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Page name: Comment Exchange [Logged in view] [RSS]
2006-08-20 17:41:49
Last author: wildmage92
Owner: HiddenFire
# of watchers: 40
Fans: 0
D20: 4
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(comment exchange banner by [jojo-kun])


Have you ever heard of a traffic exchange? The concept is simple: one visits member's sites in exchange for visits to one's own site. So in an effort to increase the exchange of comments in peoples' Elfwood galleries I, [HiddenFire], decided to start this comment exchange.

The problem:

Have you ever tried going on massive commenting runs? That's the way most amateur artists get their source of comments. They spend hours upon hours sitting in front of the computer commenting on picture after picture, hoping that a few artists will be kind enough to return the favor. What do they get out of it? Just a handful of measly comments or none at all. It's a gamble really, there is no guarantee that any artist will be the kind and curious type, and comment on your gallery in return.

The solution!

Well that's where this wiki comes in. We have taken the gamble out of it. Now it is simple to receive comments in your gallery. You are provided with links to members sites who promise comments in return!

Below is a link to the list of members. If you are starving for comments you should visit some of their galleries and leave some comments. It's not very difficult to gain comments in this way: if you only leave one comment in each gallery, that would mean you would gain at least one comment for EACH gallery you commented in. There is no guarantee you will receive more than that, but you will certainly not receive less. You actually get something for your hard work commenting. What could be better?

Or, alternatively, you could take one of the Comment exchange tours which have been put together with artwork from our members, and comment on the works you see there. You would recieve a comment back for every comment you gave out.

Constructive criticism (CC) is valued more highly than the “kool pics” comments. So leave as much CC as possible, they are more likely to return the favour with a larger number of comments in return.

You don't even need to be a member to benefit in this fashion!

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View members or sign up at Comment Exchange Members


All members are asked to submit the url of an image they would like featured in a Comment Exchange Members Tour.
Tours already put together can be found at Comment Exchange Tours!

What are the benefits of joining?


Why not just swing by and leave comments on member's galleries whenever you need comments? Well, as well as you commenting on other members' galleries and getting return from it, people would also come to you for comments if you were a member! it only takes a little more effort on your part. There is nothing wrong with simply swinging by whenever you need comments but it's extremely easy to become a member and reap the benefits.

Make sure to read the rules before going and commenting on members' sites or if you wish to join.

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We now have a page to post your updates - Comment Exchange News


Please watch that page and add to it whenever you have an update! This should help the older members and the newer members to blend a little bit better. Also, keep an eye on it for the tours! 

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Rules (ok, guidelines):

<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> Members should return the favor, but are not required to return comments in the same number they were recieved
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> Rude comments can be ignored (you don't have to return the favor in this case... it could lead to a feud)
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> Comments are suggested to be returned in kind (if someone simply says "kool pics" then members can simply say the same on their page)
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> Members should state on their galleries that they are members and what that means for those that comment on their work. Also check out Comment Exchange Declaration for some *suggested* HTML you can add to your Elftown bio. (I don't know why but everyone seems to ignore this one, this is a STRONG suggestion as it shows random stoppers by that you will return comments)
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> If you wish to join the Comment Exchange simply sign up here Comment Exchange Members
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> Currently we only support Elfwood galleries/libraries. When you sign up to be a member you MUST have a link to an EW gallery/library. Failure to comply to this rule could get you (or at least the non-EW link) deleted from the members list.
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> When you sign up, try to comment on a few members' galleries, this will help to produce an internal circulation of commenting
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> Eventually your comment load may become too great, you may not have the time to return comments, or you simply consider this wiki training wheels and decide you don't need it any longer. Then simply remove your name from the list, no big deal
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417465.jpg> The rules are subject to change. Notification of the members will be attempted. If the rule is of particular importance a vote may be held. It is suggested you watch this page for any possible changes which may occur.

Many members may decide to apply their own stipulations on top of the rules here: they may add a few rules about their returning comments, or what kind they like to recieve. Those rules may eventually make their way into the official rules here if they seem to benefit the majority.

Discussion of possible new rules, suggestions, suggested chages in structure, or just gripes and complaints can be held at Comment Exchange Propositions

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Contents


<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417659.jpg> Comment exchange members View members or sign up!
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417659.jpg> http://ngal.fateback.com/random.html View a member's site at random here (requires javascript be enabled, updated sporadically)
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417659.jpg> Comment exchange tours View the current tours put together of comment exchange members work
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417659.jpg> Comment exchange members tour Sign up for the next tour here!
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417659.jpg> Comment exchange propositions Where new suggestions etc. can be posted
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099417659.jpg> Comment Exchange News Where you can find the latest news and add let people know about updated sites!

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Related wikis/websites of interest:


<img:img/drawing/80746_1099418015.jpg> *New* Elftown Comment Exchange
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099418015.jpg> The constructive criticism club
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099418015.jpg> Constructive Criticism Wiki
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099418015.jpg> New Art Comment Club
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099418015.jpg> Comments for the comment hungry
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099418015.jpg> Wyvern's Writers United
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099418015.jpg> Fine Art Institution

Some advice about giving and recieving comments and criticism is found in these FARP articles by "Ellen Million". ~(referred by The constructive criticism club)~
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099420281.jpg> http://elfwood.lysator.liu.se/farp/guides/givecriticism.html
<img:img/drawing/80746_1099420281.jpg> http://elfwood.lysator.liu.se/farp/guides/takecriticism.html

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Feel free to ask questions, add comments, express your ideas, or voice your opinion below, in the comments box. Feedback is welcomed as it would help this community grow and develop.


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Bullets and dividers by Elftown Graphics

Username (or number or email):

Password:

2005-04-04 [HiddenFire]: Well... that really bites. I suppose I'll just go ahead and delete all those comment notification emails and start fresh. I should be getting internet access again soon... but I don't know how soon. I'm going to lose everything that was on my computer... I'm certain that it caught a virus and it is toast. I'll figure something out. I really need to start making backups. o.0

2005-04-04 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: wow. That's no fun at all.  :) heheheheh, the Mods are going to be buisy when the Wood gets back up!

2005-04-05 [jojo-kun]: Yeah that really, really sucks! I'm going to definitely make backups of the descriptions of my images and comments received in the future! >_< Yeah pity the poor Mods!

2005-04-05 [Von_Lipwig]: hmmm i thought they had, like, exactly the same problem one month ago? can't they just (i noticed myself that the word "just" is really an understatement) go offline form time to time (say one day in the week) to make a backup? that would save a lot of stress... AND work!

2005-04-05 [shotokan_gal]: Exactly the same problem? I don't remember them actually losing versions of elfwood in the 2 years I've been with them. This is pretty rare I thought.

2005-04-05 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I know they've worked with the RAID before and had some problems lately, but not like this. 

2005-04-05 [jojo-kun]: They were able to save all of the information last time (when they made the most recent backup), but it just happened again. And this time they couldn't retrieve the data. I remember last time they were saying that they may have lost months of data, but they ended up saving it.

2005-04-06 [Von_Lipwig]: well I'm not a hardware specialist, but i reckon they could make backups more often? don't get me wrong, I'm not mad at them or something, on the contrary, elfwood is the best way to display your art and i love the community, but i think it's not impossible to make back ups more often and put it on an exteral hard disk or something? you can have them up to 10 gb i think, maybe more. Anyway correct me if I'm wrong, as i said, I'm not a specialist... :$

2005-04-07 [jojo-kun]: It makes a lot of sense to do that. Personally, I would not mind at all if they had scheduled blackout periods where they went offline once every one or two weeks to create a backup. If it would avoid something like this happening again, I think I would actually be happy about it! :S

2005-04-07 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: hmmmm.... do any of you know who we can suggest this to?  Think [Hedda] might be able to do anything about it?

2005-04-07 [jojo-kun]: I was wondering who to go to with suggestions as well.... If [Hedda] could pass it on, that would be helpful!

2005-04-07 [Von_Lipwig]: cool! I have an idea that people actually like! :D

2005-04-07 [HiddenFire]: I've got internet access again... but unfortunately I lost every last bit of data on my computer. I'm not sure how much longer the internet is going to last... seeing as how I have VERY little money upon which to last. So I still won't really be able to keep up things like I would like to. :(

2005-04-08 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: well, I've messaged [Hedda] about sceduled Elfwood backup times... but he's not said anything, in fact, he hasn't read the message yet....

2005-04-08 [shotokan_gal]: Well, he is a busy guy, and not technically in charge of elfwood, only elftown.

2005-04-08 [HiddenFire]: There is an EW suggestions forum. That would be the best place to say something to that effect

2005-04-08 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: cool. i'll try there. I didn't know there was one....

2005-04-08 [shotokan_gal]: I think, reading the livejournals again recently, its something thats been suggested. The biggest obstacle in the way of which is the lack of money from things like this, as elfwood runs off donations. At least, that's what I gleaned off there.

2005-04-09 [jojo-kun]: I was the one who suggested it in livejournal. Just wanted to see what others there would think.

2005-04-09 [shotokan_gal]: *nods* I thought so. Just conveying the info to those who might not have read it...

2005-04-14 [HiddenFire]: allright, I fixed the issues with the members page... now it's not so massive. I broke it down. as soon as the next 20 are there then just add a new page. I broke it down by 20's. If someone wants to remove themselves, just do it, don't adjust anything. if more than half of any set is removed, then the entire member list might be shifted... otherwise, dont' worry about it. *just trying to clean things up where I can*

2005-04-15 [shotokan_gal]: Ohhh I like it. Might need to add a note to the main page explaining the way its split up. Not sure.

2005-04-15 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: naw, i think it's fairly simple and people shoud be able to figure it out.... besides, this main page is sofull of information already, it's nice to have a banner for it. :)

2005-04-16 [HiddenFire]: That's allright, I need to clarify a few things on those pages anyway... when I did that, I actually had to rush off to the school to get my 2D animation project done... got it just in time too! and by that I mean 10 minuets after class started (but since my name is near the end of the alphabet) I got to class just in time. ^_^

2005-04-16 [shotokan_gal]: Hehe... as long as you're there before it *properly* starts you're on time. Hence why I've never been late for a lecture yet ;)

2005-04-17 [HiddenFire]: This place (AIPX) is actually pretty cool... once I was on my way to class, met my teacher in the elevators, then just before the doors opened for that floor, she said that if he beat me to class, that he'd count me late... so we raced, I won. ^_^

2005-04-17 [HiddenFire]: In any case, I know that CE's ability to be nominated once more to the Wiki Awards is comming up this next month. I would like to organize everything and plan out the layout a bit better in preperation. I may be restructuring the way things look (just re-arranging stuff on the page). [Kshatriya Karahatay], [shotokan_gal], feel free to do some organizing as well. I'm not looking to change the info, just make it more pleasant to our audience.

2005-04-17 [shotokan_gal]: Was actually thinking of doing something like that for a while, I'll put something together involving this wikis text onto another when I get the chance, and then you can see if you like it. Oh, and sounds like a pretty cool teacher that. I've started to chat to a fair few lecturers now, think its bringing out the eccentric mathematician in me!

2005-04-17 [HiddenFire]: LOL, it's actually against school policy for teachers and students to have ANYTHING to do with one another outside of school that isn't accedimically related. A few years back one of the teachers was a little "too cool" and would actually go out to bars and clubs with students drinking it up and getting pretty wild... So now, if it isn't accedemic, they can only really acknolege them "hey" *nod of head, walk off quickly* stupid burocrocrasy... damn politics. >.< *shrugs* Now those kinds of teachers tell the kids "hey, once you graduate, invite me to the party..." LOL ^_^

2005-04-17 [shotokan_gal]: Oh my word o_0 thats shocking! I admit this is only on the corridors of the maths dept and so forth, but a history student friend of mine has a lecturer who regularly invites his dissertation group to his house for dinner and stuff like that (all at once obv, so no obvious intentions...). Of course, that sort of thing would have been frowned open in 'school' as I know it (under 18 stuff), but after that it seems to be going a bit far to ban teacher-student relations of any sort.

2005-04-17 [shotokan_gal]: Ok, after faffing about a bit I've got comment exchange layout change (lame wiki name but I couldn't think of anything better at the time) for you to check out. I've largely tried to cut down the wording and too many repetitions as much as possible, as big blocks of words put people off. I'm planning to search elftown graphics too now, to make it look a bit prettier (something simple hopefully). Let me know what you think, and feel free to use some/none/all as you wish :) I've never been a particularly huge fan of the red/pink text personally, but you're still the boss in all this.

2005-04-17 [HiddenFire]: Niceness! ^_^ with a few gramatical error corrections (probably still left over from me. o.0) and an addition of one rule that I couldn't believe I left out, we should be allright. go ahead and make the change. ^_^

2005-04-17 [shotokan_gal]: Oh hang on I'm not finished :P But I don't think its pw protected, feel free to put in. I'm looking for dividers and bullets (damn theres so many). Quite a fan of the first ones on EG Bullets (used in my house), or the second set on the next page...

2005-04-17 [HiddenFire]: *rules changed on your page... will be implemented when style is moved over* I am rather fond of the second ones on teh second page as well. ^_^

2005-04-17 [shotokan_gal]: Ah right, I noticed that. I guess it only really became obvious when we had people adding DA galleries to the list too. I did put in the first or second paragraph though a ref to elfwood I think. As for graphics, yes those fit quite well. I'm trying to find some dividers which'll complement the banner nicely. We could use the ones on all the official pages (they're in various colours), but well, everyone uses them! (though they are v good)

2005-04-17 [shotokan_gal]: Oh and another thing, don't know if anyone thinks this necessary, but if you'd rather have the banner hosted on et than photobucket (which doesn't always show up), and if [jojo-kun] doesn't mind of course, I've got the privs to upload it to ET stuff through the wiki. Of course, only if that was wanted by all parties involved...

2005-04-17 [HiddenFire]: If [jojo-kun] is hosting the image, ask her first, but it would be a good idea to have everything localized to ET.

2005-04-18 [HiddenFire]: I'm going to go ahead and implement the style change here. And see about messing around elsewhere. To clean stuff up.

2005-04-18 [jojo-kun]: [shotokan_gal], you can go right ahead and do whatever you like with the banner. It's for everyone! Thanks for the consideration though! ^_^

2005-04-18 [shotokan_gal]: There, everything's been changed except comment exchange tours which is currently password protected...

2005-04-21 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: yeah, it;s not protected anymore

2005-04-21 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: wow, this all looks very nice!

2005-04-22 [HiddenFire]: It's funny, I'm going to art school and I want to say [shotokan_gal] is going into math... and she does the decorations. o.0 oh the sweet sweet irony.

2005-04-22 [shotokan_gal]: lol... its like I say on my elfwood bio (which is currently in need of some serious updating), us sciency types can be arty too ;) I tend to be a bit of a picky perfectionist about my own wiki-pages too.

2005-04-22 [shotokan_gal]: hmm maybe I should advertise... "[shotokan_gal]'s interior design service, caters for any needs... blah blah" hehe...

2005-04-22 [HiddenFire]: You should charge a fee... but not to us, I won't pay you. :P *broke*

2005-04-24 [shotokan_gal]: Hmm... well, I'll accept cookies!

2005-04-30 [forsakenangels]: hey people, i have permission ffrom a good friend.. once i find out how im going to post her best things on my home page.. shes trying to get her name out there more... first off though.. can anyone tell me how to get pictures into my description? lol

2005-05-05 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: good Gnus!! The elfwood ticket queueueue is back open! Yay!

2005-05-05 [kerry555]: *dances* yay!!

2005-05-06 [shotokan_gal]: Yay my pics published already :) though admittedly its only the one that's been on my et house for weeks... too much work to have time to draw dammit.

2005-05-06 [kerry555]: lol mine's #934 and 946 or something... getting there!

2005-05-06 [Silver Wind]: I hope it's okay to put the banner up in my house?

2005-05-06 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: of course it is. :D

2005-05-06 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: So, good news of the day, I've retreived the entries for the first two tours and am going over them to see what, if anything, is missing in elftown.

2005-05-07 [kerry555]: thanks for the message, kshatriya, my pic is in queue:)

2005-05-10 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: the first tour is complete

2005-05-10 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: The first two tours are in queue for publishing. The third (current) tour has only two entries currently that do not work. Exciting!  

2005-05-11 [kerry555]: awesome! cant wait!

2005-05-26 [shotokan_gal]: I just had a thought today, when navigating to comment exchange from my gallery when I wasn't signed in to do some commenting, that we should perhaps export the pages CE members P1 - 5, as you currently can't reach them not logged in. In case a non-et member happened to follow the links to look for the other members. I would do it, but I think only the page-owner can.

2005-05-26 [Silver Wind]: great idea

2005-05-26 [HiddenFire]: Icky! that means I didn't export them. Oops! XD

2005-05-26 [HiddenFire]: allrighty, all is as it should be now. That was a pretty major oversight on my part. Well... I suppose that just means that the newest members got a few more comments that the older one's for a little while. o.0

2005-05-31 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: My exciting news of the day: I've finally been published in Wyvern's! Yay! Check it out! http://elfwood.lysator.liu.se/libr/k/a/karahatay2/karahatay2.html

2005-06-03 [Stray Kitty]: Apparently Elfwood's down again, or is it just my computer?

2005-06-04 [kerry555]: its down with mine too.. I cant access the extranet

2005-06-04 [Stray Kitty]: Niether can I. Wonder what happened.

2005-06-04 [kerry555]: same here... hmm...

2005-06-04 [jojo-kun]: no news yet on livejournal...

2005-06-04 [kerry555]: this is so weird!!

2005-06-04 [Li-Ga]: Elfwood is back now! :) It seems that everything is working.

2005-06-04 [kerry555]: yup! I just logged on.. not too many new comments... lol

2005-07-13 [HiddenFire]: wow, I step out and this place just up and DIES! My computer is back up and running... now I just have to get my life back in order and perhaps I'll have some time for this place again. Just remember, keep up the good work guys. ^_^

2005-07-13 [shotokan_gal]: *blinks* Dies? Well, I guess we don't comment much. But the members list is growing steadily. And I don't think (though I'm not sure) we ever got round to that wiki-awards nomination, not being sure personally of the time last year the wiki won it. Anyways, good to have you back HF, hope it lasts :)

2005-07-13 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Well, I've been waiting for the tours to get through the queue, but they seem to be stuck.... I was hoping to have them up and running before putting in a nomination for this place... but if you'd like we can nominate it now, anyway....

2005-07-13 [shotokan_gal]: I know a while ago there were still problems with tours, and they (elfwood people) hadn't got round to fixing them, so none were being published. I guess it's the same situation now then.

2005-07-15 [HiddenFire]: nah, I'm just giving you guys a hard time. I can plainly see that the members lits is growing. I think you did well enough. basically as an update, things are somewhat stable at the moment but could be changing . I'm not sure about my plans to get a website going for us... because quite honestly I ran myself into debt getting things back in order. We'll see how things turn out though. It would be really nice to be able to accept donations and all that fun stuff... but I don't have time to set any of that up. o.0

2005-07-16 [shotokan_gal]: Hehe... there hasn't really been much to do except advertise, plug, and tidy up occasionally ;) But a website o_0 that is an interesting idea.

2005-07-19 [HiddenFire]: That way, we don't have to be a subsection of elftown. I only did it this way because it was easy and free. But our own website would be VERY nice. ^_^

2005-07-19 [Silver Wind]: A own webpage? That would be mighty cool! And now to something completely different (which I'll probably get kicked for): There's a recently started wiki for facial reference photos. I know that I for one always am on the hunt for faces to look at, and good pictures are often annoyingly hard to come by. So, if you're interested, Faces: Artist Reference (I'm crossing my fingers that this isn't too out of topic)

2005-07-19 [shotokan_gal]: Well definitely an interesting idea. Elftown gets this wiki a lot of exposure to elfwood artists though, which is a useful feature of it being here. But still all behind the idea :)

2005-07-26 [HiddenFire]: *sigh* my computer has completely broken down again. I'll basically have to build a new one if I: want it working right... So once again, I'm still out of commission. Sorry guys, when it rains it pours apparently.. :(

2005-07-26 [shotokan_gal]: *hugs* don't worry, we aint going anywhere :)

2005-09-12 [HiddenFire]: LOL... and just when I get my compter all up and running great, the monitor explodes... yep, loud pop, screen changes size, smoke comes out the top. Everything is falling appart around me. :S

2005-09-12 [Stray Kitty]: Is it just me or does the moderating que seemed to be going slower.

2005-09-13 [The Coffee-Prophet]: Things have gone pretty slow overall in elfwood nowdays, think they're still catching up after the crash.

2005-09-13 [Silver Wind]: I think it's going pretty fast actually...they've worked through half of the tickets sinse I put my on last friday.

2005-09-13 [Silver Wind]: Ahem, nevermind that. It just went through. Why don't they get more moderators if it's tough to keep up?

2005-09-13 [shotokan_gal]: I think they are training more moderators at the moment, from odd snippets I've heard anyway. It takes time to train and teach them though potentially slowing down the queue for a while until they can work on their own. Must be a tough job, you've got to know the rules inside out.

2005-09-13 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: One of our old tours finally got through, but it was rejected for stuff not there *sheepish*  I'll have to go re-do it again. maybe the tour thingy is working now... It wasn't last time I tried it...

2005-09-13 [shotokan_gal]: Well, at least they're going through now. Took a while to fix it all after the crash.

2005-09-13 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: problem fixed... Now the origonal tours are in the queue again, and they should all work. :)

2005-09-13 [shotokan_gal]: Hope we seen them up again soon then :) thanks for putting the work into these, I for one appreciate it.

2005-09-13 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Hey... ummm... I also just noticed that the CE member's pages (1 through5) aren't exported.... I don't know how to do that, can one of you guys?

2005-09-13 [shotokan_gal]: Are you sure they're not? I mentioned it to HF a while ago, and I thought he fixed it. Only the page owner can export pages I think though.

2005-09-14 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: you're right, they are exported.... I wonder why it told me they weren't... oh well, it's working now so it's all good. ;)

2005-09-16 [Silver Wind]: You know what I think we should have? An update page. So that when an artist updates their gallery they can put their name on top of the list, so the rest of us know when there's new pictures around.

2005-09-17 [Li-Ga]: Nice idea, I am sure it will promote new art.

2005-09-19 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: That is a good idea.

2005-09-19 [Kidnero]: A good idea, Silver Wind. You're a clever girl.

2005-09-19 [Silver Wind]: Okay, now you're just transparent. :P

2005-09-27 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Wonderful news everybady!!! The tours just got through the queue!  We've got tours again! yay!!

2005-09-27 [Silver Wind]: Yay!

2005-09-27 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: ok ya'll, here it is.  PLease Edit!!  Comment Exchange News

2005-09-28 [Silver Wind]: Well done!

2005-09-28 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: It still needs all the cool fonts and images and everythiong, but I don't have the time right now to do all the html stuff (don't remember it right now) so if anyone else wants to play with it please do!

2005-09-28 [shotokan_gal]: Great idea, and nice work :) The page looks fine to me html-wise, it matches the others in set up and that. I'm not online much at the moment, but hopfully in a week or so I'll be able to get on elftown more regularly, and can help out then if you like / still want it.

2005-10-07 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Good news everybody!  To find out what it is, go to the comment exchange news! *diabolical laughter ensues*

2005-10-09 [Kidnero]: I've just made a change to the news page! :)

2005-10-14 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Congratulatiosn Everybody! The Comment Exchange Has just, once again been accepted in the Wiki Awards!

2005-10-17 [Stray Kitty]: Alright. I just want to know something. Did the uploading picture to the Extranet change? I can't find the browse picture button. Anyone know anything about it?

2005-10-17 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: ..wish I could help... Sadly, I've got a ticket in the queue and can't check that out....  :(

2005-10-17 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I did notice, though, last time I uploaded a picture that they had changed some stuff. I found it rather annoying, but the browse button was still where it had been. Of course, that's not to say they haven't moved it. :)

2005-10-18 [Li-Ga]: I don't have this problem but, [Stray Kitty],you are not the only one with this problem -> http://www.livejournal.com/community/elfwood/?1167 !

2005-10-18 [Stray Kitty]: Okay, Thank you.

2005-10-18 [Stray Kitty]: Okay, THank you.

2005-12-13 [daydreamer]: Dude, I've been taking to time to write carefully considered construtive crit. and the artists, comment exchange members, are shooting down my suggestions. I tried to be as polite as possible. Sheez. Just venting.

2005-12-14 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: really? I've never gotten negitive feedback from the artists I comment on...

2005-12-14 [Silver Wind]: That's too bad. Some people just can't take crit...

2006-01-08 [Stray Kitty]: Anyone noticed how slow the ticket que has gotten. I tried to update a guided tour of mine sometime in November or December and it's still only in the 300's.

2006-01-08 [Li-Ga]: Yep, the mod's are too busy...as always...

2006-01-09 [Stray Kitty]: Hmm. I was just a little puzzled, normally it moves slow and then when it gets to about the 2 or 3 hundreds it moves faster.

2006-01-09 [shotokan_gal]: It depends on which ticket queue your piece is in too... tours are dealt with differently from just uploading pictures as far as I know (I'm not actually a mod myself). For example, I uploaded a pic in December and it was up in just over a week. But maybe less people do tours *shrugs*

2006-01-09 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: It seems like tours get stuck on the lower numbers

2006-02-05 [Stray Kitty]: Is Elfwood down again? I can't access it and I'm not sure if it's my computer or a Swedish Thunderstorm.

2006-02-05 [Li-Ga]: As it seems, Elfwood is down, so you are not alone.

2006-02-06 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: It's ot working for me, either.

2006-03-18 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: FYI I went through and got rid of all the empty spaces. In all, we've only lost about ten people, which, I think, is pretty impressive. :)  So, If you go to look for yourself and find you're not where you were, try looking about ten spaces less from where you were and that's probably about where you are.

2006-06-13 [NOOOPE]: Wow.... this is a super sweet idea... I may just have to return in a little while...

2006-06-14 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I've thought it's worked pretty well.

2006-07-21 [Estantia]: It's almost a pity really, I've largely stopped working with my elfwood library, all of my recent stories are on elftown instead >.< maybe I could start work but again... such a lot of time when elftown is faster...

2006-08-10 [Stray Kitty]: Has anyone noticed that since the random picture on the Elfwood main page was added, there's been less Mod's Choices?

2006-08-10 [moonscale]: Do you do comment exchanges on ET galleries? I think that would be nice. Because some people don't post on Elfwood. ET is so much faster and you can 'build' your gallery however you like.

2006-08-10 [Estantia]: that's what I meant, my library is now on here, for much the same reasons.

2006-08-10 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I suppose we could. All you'd have to do is add a link to your ET gallery as well...

2006-08-10 [shotokan_gal]: Well one of the rules above is: Currently we only support Elfwood galleries/libraries. When you sign up to be a member you MUST have a link to an EW gallery/library. Failure to comply to this rule could get you (or at least the non-EW link) deleted from the members list. - made by [HiddenFire], the original owner of the wiki.
It's a nice idea :) though it might not apply to everyone who has an et gallery and has signed up here. Most et comments I get will be along the lines of 'that one's my favourite pic' or comments on all the art in general, and people might have multiple galleries for different things which I could or could not comment on (personally). Whereas in elfwood I get a lot more individual comments on pictures (but that depends how you set up your gallery as you said), and you get a link directly back to them which always helps.

2006-08-10 [shotokan_gal]: In short, since I'm not sure if I made much sense there, elfwood (and DA and others) is set up as an art gallery as it's main purpose, so as a result it's slightly more suited to exchanging comments. (This doesn't necessarily mean I'm completely against the idea by the way :P )

2006-08-10 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: True. That's what I get for not re-reading the rules lately. I guess the other thing we could do is create another comment exchange wiki, call it something like elftown comment exchange and tie it back to this wiki...

2006-08-10 [shotokan_gal]: That could work :) Another thing I thought of (not meaning to be negative!) is that all the member lists on here are exported, to allow anyone from elfwood (whos not on elftown) who finds the link, to find other comment exchangers easily. But having a wiki in partnership with this one could work really well :D

2006-08-10 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I didn't realize the pages weren't exported. There.. I think everything's exported now

2006-08-10 [shotokan_gal]: They are though :/ (unless that was a typo). At least, the first 5 pages of them were (and the main with the newest). So that if someone links to the page on their elfwood bio it works for people not logged in.

2006-08-10 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Ah, now that I reread it I see. But there were a couple pages that wern't exported that I set to exported.

2006-08-10 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Well, I've started setting it up at Elftown Comment Exchange.

2006-08-11 [Estantia]: Thankyou, it looks a nice idea :D

2006-08-13 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Ok, well I've done a little bit more on the elftown comment exchange Take a look, leave comments or advise...

2006-08-13 [Estantia]: or just plain join, I'd be happy to help with this, it really is a good idea.

2006-09-01 [H3_six]: Hi, I stumbled across this by accident and it's a really good idea. Those who want comments can get them. YAY!

2006-09-01 [Estantia]: yeah, it's really useful, I know the max feedback I usually get is ok/interesting.

2006-09-01 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: i usually try to comment on the new people's work. Then, of course, i always reply to those who comment on my stuff. I usually do comment for comment, though.

2006-09-01 [Estantia]: same, however few people comment on the stuff I need comments on lol

2006-09-04 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: *grins* that's why we made the comment exchange news page for, to try to help get comments on that which needed comments for those who are still active with us.

2006-10-09 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: *notice* if you had a stop on one of the comment excahnge tours and you're no longer there, (or if this happens some time in the future) it is most likely because the tour got rejected because your piece did not meet ERB standards (this just happened on four of the existing tours, so I had to take them out, but the updates haven't been published yet, so nothings actually removed yet)

2006-11-10 [HiddenFire]: Wow, we're almost at 150 members! That's awesome! Everyone is doing really well with this in my absence. Unfortunately I'm still not going to be coming back any time soon, perhaps I might not come back at all. I just stopped by to see how everyone was doing and I'm really impressed. Keep up the good work.

2007-09-03 [Blakkduv]: huh...

2007-09-21 [HiddenFire]: We sure haven't grown much in a while... perhaps I do need to get back into it. Does anyone think that having our own web space might help things along? I could set it up, I'm starting to get a hang of the whole web site development thing. I could probably bang something together. However, I don't want to put any effort (or money) into it, if it's not going to go anywhere.

2007-09-24 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: It might work better being off elftown since then any of the elfwood artists/writers could participate. We've talked about expanding, too, so that it could be a comment exchange for more than just Elfwood, too, but we couldn't think of a good way to facilitate that here in elftown.

2007-09-25 [HiddenFire]: I think the best option would be to contain each "exchange" in it's own bubble. In effect, if an EW artist comments on another EW artist then they comment in return. However, if a DA artist comments on an EW artist, there is no obligation to comment in return. Essentially, it would be in an effort to keep things contained and separated. That's the only way I can think to do it. I'm also going to lobby for a feature on EW that shows the comment ratio of a member in (comments given /c comments received) fashion. Those with higher ratios, will be those who are obviously keeping up the comment for comment practice. I think it might work. I would eventually like to get the blessings and support of at least the EW staff and crew so that we can integrate membership notices on the pages of the members, as well as offer a "random CE member image" feature. However, first, we must prove that we are big, strong, and self-sustaining. We've got to show that we are serious about this thing. If we can do that, I think we'll be in business.

2007-09-25 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I think the biggest problem to the CE, though, is that most of the members only joined elftown to join CE and have never been back. I only say this because I periodically send out e-mails to everyone (I'm a glutton for punishment that way) and notice that a majority of the e-mails are never read, mostly because the users haven't been on for years.

2007-09-25 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Though I think the idea of the "bubbles" is a good idea, in fact, a must. However, the biggest hinderance is the fact that it is based in Elftown. I think it would flourish if, akin to Bifrost, it had it's own group thing that sent e-mail notifications and updates to people's "real" e-mail addresses. I think your website would be a great boon in this. Also, if you do not want to pay for the webspace, which is totally understandable, I can offer up my own server for the task. The only thing with that is that I don't know how to write the code. So, if you'd want to write the code, I'd be happy to host the page.

2007-09-25 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: We could also keep the CE here as it is for the EW stuff, and expand it, as people showed intrest in doing, to their own wiki pages here in ET. So, ET hosts the ET wiki CE, and the original EW CE (to allow for random CE memembers and stuff, pending approval of the ET staff). The EW comment exchange could then expand out to an external website, and etablish sister CE's such as DeviantArt and whatever's requested...  I'm hoping I'm making sense with this. 
The benefits of moving to an external server would be that we could send out e-mails to e-mails that people actually check, and we wouldn't have the inactive user issues so much, I think. 
Oh the possibilities.... :)

2007-09-26 [HiddenFire]: I agree totally. Don't worry about webspace, I've got a boatload of space on my host right now that I'm barely cracking into about .2% of my space and less than .01% of my bandwidth. I need to start a project that will utilize the mess of resources I'm paying for! I like the email idea. We can also ensure that people stay active this way. If emails continue to bounce back for 30+ days and they have not logged into the site for 30+ days, we can suspend their membership. This way we can cut down on the moochers.

2007-09-26 [HiddenFire]: I've set up CE Brainstorm to help us sort our brains out on the issue. When we actually launch the site, we need to go through EVERY member's gallery, email, etc... and get in contact with them. Let them know that we've moved and encourage them to remain active.

2007-09-26 [Estantia]: I am a member, it's just that I haven't had any comments, plus I can't do much right now, uni...

2007-09-26 [HiddenFire]: There has got to be some way to get members more comments. The only problem is that when it comes right down to it, we can't enforce any of this. All we can do is encourage people to comment on member's galleries. It's not like we can offer incentives to comment other than the chance to get more comments on their gallery. It's pretty tough when you think about it.

2007-09-26 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I think the closest we could come to it though is have the people who log in the most - the active members - be the first to be found, and have inactive member not show up in the random thing. more on the other page....

2007-09-28 [HiddenFire]: ah, I see. The random page would produce results based on a weighted average. So that the more active a member is (time logged in and posts in the forums) the more likely they are to show up? That is a fantastic idea... but would be difficult to implement. Keep in mind, none of us are big time web programmers... are we? I was thinking about going with a wordpress base and modifying the theme appropriately. I inteded the forums to be based on phpBB. I think that it might be possible for us to remove inactive members from the random link. That shouldn't be a problem at all. That way it's at least somewhat fair.

2007-09-28 [Estantia]: Hm, a weighted average... I may know someone who could be able to help with that but I'm not entirely sure.

2007-09-28 [HiddenFire]: weighted averages aren't that hard to set up. But setting up a system that logs and tracks logins and forum posts for that purpose would be very difficult.

2007-09-28 [HiddenFire]: I was thinking that the random redirect could work like this: 50% chance of picking only from donators or everyone (including donators). If everyone: 50% chance of picking from just active members or from everyone (including active and inactive members). That would be easy as pie. Every month, we evaluate whether or not members have logged in or posted in the forums, then put them in lists accordingly. All we need is three lists (Donor, active, inactive). All of which would be very easy to track.

2007-10-04 [HiddenFire]: In any case, those are issues we can sort out once we get the site up. My main questions are: Will this be successful? Will the community stay active? Will I be wasting my time/money if I invest in this?

I want to make this work, I want people to get good quality comments on their galleries. I want to be able to help out budding artists and writers and get them exposure. I think this could do it. If I can expect your help, I think this is possible.

What say you?

As far as the issues with the way things will operate, I can open a forum for discussions about it all and even host polls so that members can vote and have a direct impact on the way things work. We can sort all of that out later. For now, should I buy the domain name and set up a rudimentary website?

2007-10-04 [HiddenFire]: Domain name ideas (all available... sebdomains would be ew. and da.):
www.thecommentexchange.com
www.exchangecomments.com
www.critexchange.com
www.crit-xchange.com
www.CRITIQUEXCHANGE.COM

Any other suggestions would be welcome... I'm still not jazzed about any of them. Feel free to check out the avialability of other domain names at:
https://www.godaddy.com/gdshop/registrar/search.asp?isc=ffsearch&ci=8969

I'm looking for something that will work well with ew. and da. subdomains. It also needs to be easy to remember and sound cool. Let me know if you think of anything.

2007-10-04 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: I like the critique ones better. I think in the big wide world of the web having the term critique would help draw the people we're looking for and help curious people understand quicker what we're about. And, like you said, i'm not jazzed about any of them. I'll see what else I can think of.

2007-10-04 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Thinking more on it, though, I think I really do like THECRITIQUEEXCHANGE.COM or critiqueexchange.com.  Or even with only one e would be cool too, though if we got bigger it might be good to buy up them both, lest we end up like homestarrunner where if you forget an r it takes you to a "less than family friendly" site...

2007-10-05 [HiddenFire]: we could go with a simple www.commentexchange.org
.com is already taken but .org would give us a sense of... well organization. Because it would be about community. I could also put .com under backorder so that I might be able to grab it when it becomes available.

I like critique... but it's harder to spell than comment.

2007-10-06 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: That's true, too (about critique being harder to spell). I do really like the .org and agree with yout thoughts in that regard. 
Hmmm... I feel that critique feels a little more, professional, or something. Like it's more straight forward about what artists and writers want...

2007-10-06 [HiddenFire]: I think it might be better, however, to suggest CC instead of suggesting that it is enforced... if you know what I mean. Obviously we would have articles and links to articles about CC as well as articles on color theory, composition, etc... that way people will learn the vocabulary needed to give a proper CC. Sometimes though, people are going to get "nice pics" comments and there's no reason to lead people to believe that they could receive an actual critique in exchange for a "coll stuff" comment. I just think that critique might be a bit confusing. Comment Exchagne sums up what we're about fairly well, it's easy to remember and if we set it up with a .org we'll be doing just fine. I would say that we should expcet a launch in the next couple of months. probably within 5-8 weeks.

2007-10-08 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: Fair enough. I think commentexchange.org would be fine then, as you said, it's pretty straight forward.

2007-10-11 [HiddenFire]: OK, the domain name has been purchased. However, I won't be able to work on it until... about... 5-6 weeks from now. I'll keep you updated though.

2007-10-12 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: ok, cool.  Good luck on whatever it is you're doing in the interim. :D

2007-10-13 [HiddenFire]: I've just got some tough classes right now. Once they're over, I'll be able to devote more time to other things.

2007-11-08 [HiddenFire]: Alright, I've got the preliminary skeleton of the site up and running. I should be able to set up a message board soon too. The theme is easily changed so don't go thinking that's what we're sticking with. For now we just have to get in there, dig around in the code and tweak it to fit our needs. I'm all for making anyone who wants to help fellow admins in order to accomplish this. If anyone knows a fellow artist who knows PHP and MYSQL and prefereable also WordPress and PHPBB then PLEASE try to see if they'll help out... but don't spam.

This is going to be a community, type site. I think we missed out on the whole community thing here. People just signed up to get the comments and never came back. We need to encourage people to come back on a regular basis.

Until I get the forum set up, we'll keep the discussions here.
Check out the basic site so far at: http://www.commentexchange.org

I've only got one class this session, hopefully it won't be a tough on me as last session and I can actually manage to get stuff done. I want to try to get as much done in the next 5.5 weeks as possible (because next session I'll have 2 tough classes again).

Thanks for all the support and encouragement. Lets go make something big! Let make something that matters! Let us take elfwood by storm and have them running to get to us. I know we can do it.

YAH!

2007-11-12 [HiddenFire]: Alright guys, I'm in the process of setting it all up. I've got a simple forum up and running and you can register as a user and have your url display immediately. It even sorts EW and DA users.

Right now I need to figure out ideas for forum groups and forums inside those groups. That should be fun.

2007-11-12 [HiddenFire]: Head on over to http://www.commentexchange.org and take a look at how things are moving. I need to get some registered users in the database so that I can test that everything works right. So far... it seems to behave alright... but it's just me in there.

2007-11-12 [HiddenFire]: Now that the site is up and running, I'm going to be spending time making it pretty. We need to get some more users in... so I guess we'll have to go through and send messages to each and very member on our list. Actual emails would be best, that way we'll make sure they know. Or perhaps just a simple comment on the main page of their gallery. That way, it's also an announcement that other EW/DA members will see.

Thanks for the support everyone. Lets make the best out of this.

2007-11-13 [HiddenFire]: Oh hey, just wanted to mention that because I'm just that awesome, we're ranked as the #1 page on google for the search "comment exchange" which is about as good as anyone could ask for. I don't think anyone will have a problem finding us.

2007-11-15 [HiddenFire]: I just wanted to let everyone know that I'm going through EW galleries and commenting on galleries of those who have the term "comment exchange" in their user profile. I figured that these people would be the most active members (as opposed to those who joined and never added the declaration to their pages).

Feel free to do what I'm doing (I'm not done yet). Just make sure that I haven't already left the notice. and if you do leave a notice, also leave a comment about their art, that way you do not get flagged for spam.

Just thought you should know.

2007-11-15 [Estantia]: My stuff on elftown's more updated than elfwood by a LONG way, I treat elfwood more as an archive ^_^'

I'm also finding myself with a fair bit of uni work too, so that's taking up creative/commenting time too.

2007-11-15 [HiddenFire]: That's cool, the ET CE will remain here, but as a reduced Comment Exchange, Dedicated completely to ElfTown Artists. I think that would greatly increase ET Artist's commenting and traffic rates. Hopefully this move should benefit everyone.

2007-11-15 [Estantia]: of course, who know, I may eventually get my own site/gallery... somewhere...

2007-11-16 [HiddenFire]: I've got all of the above... except none on ET. I've got an EW a DA and my own site with it's own domain. Actually, EW and DA are great for sending traffic back to a main gallery site. In all honesty, for me, it's about driving traffic back to my gallery site. I consider EW and DA community sites more than gallery sites. That being said, I'm all about the community of it. I consider the CE a niche in the community. So far, we're the only one's in this niche... you can't beat that.

I'm thinking about opening up the CE to blogs as well... but I can't make up my mind. Every other aspect of the CE is about art and writing (stories)... not blog articles. The only advantages to doing so would be that traffic to the CE would DRASTICALLY increase. I'm not sure what the other effects might be... I'm just afraid that the bloggers will take over. *shrugs* I don't know. I'm still thinking about it.

2007-11-16 [Estantia]: it's your site, I'm sure you'll work something out.

2007-11-17 [HiddenFire]: Well, that's not what I wanted to hear. :P
For now, I think I'll just see how things go and work from there. We're gaining members slowly but surely. I think the advantage of using ET was the fact that we could leverage the advertising of the wiki awards. I remember our membership exploding just after we won. I'm not sure how we could get similar results. Who knows.

2007-11-18 [Estantia]: hm, i can't say i know that much myself, maybe get the word to pass around deviant art?

2007-11-18 [HiddenFire]: I think I might have to go on some massive commenting runs to help build up traffic. If I make some great comments on other people's galleries, they'll follow those comments back to mine and see what I declare myself to be, a CE member. It's possible. I'm just totally against outright advertising for that particular site. My other two sites... I'll pimp those out whenever I get the chance! ^_^

2007-11-19 [Estantia]: :P hehehe

2007-11-20 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: hate to help your indecision, but I'm not sure about adding bloggers either...
On the one hand it would increase traffic to your site, and if you had paid advertising on it, that would be the way to go to make money. The down side, like you said, is that bloggers would probably take over. I tend to think that if you really want to do something of the sort for bloggers you could create a sister site for them. I don't know, i just wouldn't want some depressed teenager who only blogs about death and suicide and can't form a sentence without cussing every other word putting garbage comments on my artwork just so I'll look at his blog so that he can feel... something.
Maybe I'm a mean person that way. But I think, as an artist, I want to help other artists and writers and be critiqued by people who are thoughtful and know what they're talking about. However, I've found that *most* (not by any means ALL) bloggers/people who join internet communities don't fall into this category. 
Hmmm... I'd better stop now before I insult someone. :)

2007-11-20 [HiddenFire]: Even if you insult the stupid whiny death obsessed kids, who cares? But I digress. Nah, I suppose I should state in the rules that the comment exchange is essentially several different bubbles... that is to say, that if a deviant art artist comments on an EW gallery... there is no oblication to return the comment. Also, if a blogger comments on your artwork, then you would not be obligated to comment on their blog.

The only time the bubbles intersect would be for EW galleries and libraries. I must admit, I don't really read much. If an EW artist comments on my artwork and they are also a writer, I will opt to comment on their artwork instead of reading their stories. I guess I'm lazy like that.

2007-11-20 [HiddenFire]: oh, and I set you up as another admin, K. You've got almost as much power over the site now as I do. You just lack ftp access, but you can still upload stuff... somewhere, I know there's a link. But that doesn't really matter. I trust you, feel free to do what you want with your new found powers... but don't delete me, that would be mean. :P

2007-12-12 [Kshatriya Karahatay]: lol!  oh, alright, I won't delete you. ;)

2007-12-12 [HiddenFire]: ^_^ I'm grateful. Heck, even if you did, all I would have to do to get access back would be to manually put me back into the database as an admin... might be difficult to do though. hmmmmm... yeah. But anyway. I'm really linking how things are going.

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